Winter fishing question

[blake]

1) Coosa Bass-  Note that my experience with redeye is outside their native range on streams that have distinct segments (waterfalls) and are heavily spring/ground water influenced.  If the water is low enough to wade (base ground water flows or close to it) , coosa feed aggressively.  I am not sure if they bite readily because of the low productive of these streams (sandstone/bedrock) or due to warmer water from the ground water.

2) Northern Spotted Bass-  Most of my streams have very few KY but I catch them every winter but rarely the rest of the year.  This is the reason I believe they belong in the No2 slot, although I probably could be convinced that could be moved elsewhere on the list, especially on streams with denser and fishable populations.

3) Largemouth Bass-  True homebodies that need to keep eating all winter long.  Put it on their nose, and they might bite it.  Catch one, their will probably be more on the same piece of structure.  Once you figure the "pattern"; you can get into numbers.

4) Smallmouth Bass-  Toughest to pattern.  Winter hole is a misnomer, IMO.  They do range farther than largies but they will only move as far as they need to.  The best fishing areas for big fish have the spawning, summer, and winter area all in close proximity to each other. The more they have to move, the less energy they can convert to growth, IMO.  

If you have the skills, float the river at extremely high flows and note any area that offers protection from the high flows (or ice flows), this will get you in the general area of winter areas.  Finding the spot within the spot (swis) is much more difficult.  The quicker the access to feeding area the better the swis.  Also look for underwater ledges, undercut rocks, or other structures that may offer hidden "rooms" for protection. Islands and feeder streams can also add positive elements to the swis.  Once you find a winter area, check out a topography map and look for similar spots on other segments of the same river or other rivers in the same watershed.

Lastly, loose lips sinks ships.  Locations for big winter fish and everybody's ears perk up, also be careful with pictures that identify the wintering area.  Be safe (winter flows are usually higher) and be patient.  

[DoahRiverRat]

Blake nailed it for the smallie category. "Winter Hioles" for most guys here in the mid-atlantic means the deepest, slowest water they can find, they never consider any other features but deep slow holes... Tain't necessarily so. As he said, the spot within the spot is the true holy grail. Blake and I have a mutual friend down Fredericksburg-way that I go winter hawg huntin' with regularly (mostly cause few others are as crazy as we are) during winter. We generally fish the week after Christmas up here at least 2 days, and some years three if the weather cooperates, since we're both off work that week. We have one spot we make a point to get to every year that NOBODY would think would hold smallies in winter, but it has all the elements Blake spoke of: Deep water, close to a "grocery store" with ledges and undercuts that allow them to get out of heavy current. Most guys we know only fish it during the summer months. But the smallies will hold there all year long. We both have scored 18"+ fish out this particualr area just about every year for the past 7 or 8 years. There's been some years we've both landed multi fish in the dead of winter out of this spot.

Blake, if you can make it up here sometime in the cold months...we'll show it to ya.  I'd be willing to bet you've even fished it before.

[wilp]

4) Smallmouth Bass-  Toughest to pattern.  Winter hole is a misnomer, IMO.  They do range farther than largies but they will only move as far as they need to.  The best fishing areas for big fish have the spawning, summer, and winter area all in close proximity to each other. The more they have to move, the less energy they can convert to growth, IMO.  

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Agreed.

Up here we call  it a "winter hole" but it is usually located within sight of where we catch 'em earlier in the year. I really don't see what you would call a "migration" to these areas, its more or less a re-location.

[blake]

DoahRiverRat said:

Blake, if you can make it up here sometime in the cold months...we'll show it to ya.  I'd be willing to bet you've even fished it before.

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Ah to see you get towed 1/4 mile downstream by a carp, that was fun.  Does the offer also extend for warm or hot weather too?

[Boyscout]

Blake, if you can make it up here sometime in the cold months…we'll show it to ya.  I'd be willing to bet you've even fished it before.

DoahRiverRat, if blake fails to take that offer, I'm your huckleberry, suh. Remember Tombstone with Val Kilmer, Russel, Elliot, and Paxton?

If you have the skills, float the river at extremely high flows and note any area that offers protection from the high flows (or ice flows), this will get you in the general area of winter areas.  Finding the spot within the spot (swis) is much more difficult.  The quicker the access to feeding area the better the swis.  Also look for underwater ledges, undercut rocks, or other structures that may offer hidden "rooms" for protection. Islands and feeder streams can also add positive elements to the swis.  Once you find a winter area, check out a topography map and look for similar spots on other segments of the same river or other rivers in the same watershed.

Drew, FB? I 'm thinking of the first slow stretch below a certain island but we have to find the swis. Maybe we don't have to go all the way down to the lake after all. As a bonus, jusding from what I read on those DNR reports, some fish move upstream to wintering holes and all those warm weather fish that just love that next iisland/shoals area just downstream, may move up into the same wintering hole.

I got a wet suit and other cold weather gear and also my depth finder. Come December, maybe we should do some experimenting.

BS

[DoahRiverRat]

blake said:

DoahRiverRat said:

Blake, if you can make it up here sometime in the cold months…we'll show it to ya.  I'd be willing to bet you've even fished it before.

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Ah to see you get towed 1/4 mile downstream by a carp, that was fun.  Does the offer also extend for warm or hot weather too?

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See?…I KNEW you'd figure out where I was talking about.  And that was one wild "Nantucket Sleighride" that Carp took me on that day. I still razz Pete about paddling over after I called him over to get a picture, and then turning away and leaving with a "Thats not a smallie"…and just paddle on away. I WANTED A PICTURE !@#$%^&  That thing was as long as my leg and woulda gone at least 25 pounds!. Biggest fish I've caught out of the yak yet! But do I have a picture of it???

NOOOOOoooo

And you KNOW that invitation stands for anytime you get back up to NoVA…the doors (and boat seats) are always open bud.

[ol' Feller]

What water temp constitutes "winter time" for making the fish move to winterholes? (talkin' NC, SC, TN, GA areas)

[blake]

ol Feller said:What water temp constitutes "winter time" for making the fish move to winterholes? (talkin' NC, SC, TN, GA areas)

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For me, mid-40's and lower.  For me a temperature reading is not as important as water level and temperature trend.  For example, I much rather fish a rise from 37 to 41 than a steady 45.

[Boyscout]

Got to rereading this post.

I never hit the initial question about which species is easier in winter. Could not comment due to lack of experience.

Blake said:

3) Largemouth Bass-  True homebodies that need to keep eating all winter long.

Blake, you saying up your way, the LM don't move or move much for the winter?

Also, do you ever find that the smallies stack up with LM in the LM's home hole? Maybe because the conditions favor both species?

Thanks for sharing this information, you too Doah.

At least now, I have an idea of where to start looking instead of wasting valuable fishing hours blindly casting. Last 2 winters, I have done maybe a dozen trips and only had one 14" LM and one 3+ pounder that shook the hook at the boat. Yeah, them winter LM and SM have been spanking me.

BS

[blake]

Saying that they don't move very far from summer time, if at all.  Once you find a "pattern" it will be consistent.

[dimecovers3]

blake said:

ol Feller said:What water temp constitutes "winter time" for making the fish move to winterholes? (talkin' NC, SC, TN, GA areas)

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For me, mid-40's and lower.  For me a temperature reading is not as important as water level and temperature trend.  For example, I much rather fish a rise from 37 to 41 than a steady 45.

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While I agree that rising temps are way better than warmer steady temps I have found one huge exception: snowstorms put big fish on a feeding frenzy. Two outta my three best days all time ever were in the middle of snowstorms.

[FBMoche]

I agree on the LM being the easiest for winter catching, at least for me.

BS and BD - I am ready to find a couple of smallie holes this winter.  I managed only 1 smalljaws from post turkey day until the first week in March this past season.  I obviously was not in the right spot or working the rights baits or most likely both.

[DoahRiverRat]

Yep..Bucketmouths are easier to catch in winter. Again, on the same float I mentioned above, Blake and mine's buddy Pete and I found some sunken wood off an upstream point of a feeder stream where the LM were stacked up like cordwood. The wood was hanging on right at the edge of an 8 foot drop off out of the current and there they were, suspended in about 6 feet of water. All you had to do was toss heavy tubes or a jig and pig , twitch it once and they were ON. We both sat there one first week of January with another buddy (Blake..you know Spud too I believe) and just reeled in 2 and 3 pounders, one after another. All of us probably landed a dozen fish in about an 45 mintes. Spud finally left because he wanted to find smallmouth, declaring this kind of fishing "like shooting fish in a barrel". Well yeah…thats kinda idea, right?

Patience, knowing your water, and did I mention Patience?…are the keys. You'll fish all day for one or 2 good bites. and someotimes it'll tkae 2 or trips for those bites! But when they come…you're more likely to be rewared with a trophy smallmouth than any other time of the year.

One more note of advice…be VERY careful about the days and the places you choose to go winter fishing. DO NOT go solo. Check the weather closely. And make dang sure you are geared up right for both the cold and water temperatures. NO cotton clothing, go all nylon or quick-dry fabrics. Carry a full "bailout" bag, with a set of dry clothes, some extra food (non perishable) and the equipment to start a fire and get something hot to drink inside of you in short order. Throw in some of those chemical handwarmer pouches too. Use two in the gloves, two in the boots, and put one under your hat. You'll be amazed at the difference they make. Hypothermia kills..and does it quickly if you're wet and cold. Another word to the wise: there is NO such thing as a water-proof match..or lighter. Ziptop sandwich bags, and cheaper dry bags do indeed leak. Flint and Steel will ALWAYS work…wet or dry..to start a fire. Practice using it before you go.

[wilp]

.

At least now, I have an idea of where to start looking instead of wasting valuable fishing hours blindly casting. Last 2 winters, I have done maybe a dozen trips and only had one 14" LM and one 3+ pounder that shook the hook at the boat. Yeah, them winter LM and SM have been spanking me.

BS

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Unfortunately the only way I figured it out (or at least as much as I have thus far, I'm no expert) was to dunk a jig and see if it got bit. Took many a spankings and still do occasionally.

The funny thing is once you find a spot it will always produce year to year. Its the toughst pattern to establish but the most consistent once you do. Yeah there'll be some days better than others due to warming trends and what not but the fish will be there.

Some holes/eddies just seem to have it and some don't. Might have to do with some of the elements Blake mentioned.

My apologies to Blake as well for sidetracking, at my latitude river bassin is rather one dimesional. Heck, I never even heard of a Shoal Bass before I joined here. Now I'm fascinated with the "other" bass species and envy you guys with access to such a variety of fishing.

Lotta info here, nice!

[BasserDrew]

Great thread guys.  I have never fished for redeyes in the winter really but can see them staying active and agressive because they do tend to prefer cooler water anyway and don't have the abundant food sources in most of their native streams. 

Moche and Boyscout, I am ready to find them too and I think we will.  I know where you speak of boyscout and that is right where I was thinking they will be.  In fact all this winter talk is making me think of a new River Mission to add.  I'll have to figure out latitude lines but I think I'll add a winter fishin' mission where the goal is to catch a bass when the water temp is below a certain temp.  It isn't easy to catch them in some of the cooler months so it may be a fun mission to shoot for.